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Firearms control

Written by on 20 August, 2010 : 09:30

This week's note from Douglas Batchelor, Chief Executive.

Take a step back and ask yourself these two questions: Why do we allow people to hold firearms at home and why do we allow them to use them to shoot and kill animals for sport?

There are an estimated seven million airguns in the hands of an estimated four million owners. There were at least 1.4m licensed shotguns and 435,000 certificated firearms licenses granted in the last ten years to over half a million people.

By any measure there are a heck of a lot of guns in the hands of the general public and it is equally clear that the vast majority of those guns are not held as a working day requirement of the gun holders’ job. The rational question to ask, is do the public really need the guns that they hold?

Gun laws have a long history and to understand some of where we have ended up with guns, it is important to remember that the right to bear arms was fought over between king and citizens as far back as the eighteenth century. The citizens’ rights to form militias and bear arms were even written into the American onstitution as a consequence of those early arguments about who had the right to bear arms.

Aside from the armed services, there are very few professions in today’s society where the professional needs to bear arms. Sections of the police may need to do so to deal with gun carrying criminals and people like slaughtermen may need captive bolt guns in their work. Gamekeepers and people looking after stock also often claim the need to have guns at home in order to deal with so called ‘pests’. That said, such claims should be treated with some considerable caution.

It is very clear that the vast majority of the guns and firearms held by members of the public are held to be used for sport and recreation. At least some of the guns and firearms are used for static target shooting, while others are held for shooting at moving but inanimate targets such as clay pigeons. The majority of the guns held are held for the specific purpose of shooting wild mammals and birds, mostly for sport and recreational purposes.

The Home Affairs Select Committee are looking into the firearms control lessons to be learnt from the recent sad events in Cumbria. Responses to the Committee must be with them by the end of next week.

The obvious question to ask, is should the person who shot so many people have had a licensed firearm or shotgun? The second question to ask is what if anything in terms of gun control could have prevented the tragedy that happened?

The bloodsports lobby will argue that law should not be made on the basis of one bad case and that the majority of gun owners are not a problem. While on the face of it that is true, it completely avoids the big questions that should be asked and answered.

The biggest question of all that needs to be asked is whether or not we as a society accept that people use live animals as targets for sport. On the occasions that the League has asked that question over the years, the answer has always been a resounding no.

The second question must then be how we deal with the cases where the claim is made that the killing is necessary and that it can be done humanely with a gun. All the available evidence suggests that even the best shots with shotguns miss their targets on occasion and frequently wound rather than kill their targets. Typically on a pheasant shoot only 50% of the birds shot at are brought down. By any reasonable measure that is not humane killing with a gun – just have a look at the film we published on the ‘glorious’ twelfth.
 
The third question that needs to be addressed is the competence of the person to whom the shotgun license or firearm certificate is being granted. A gun, just like a car, can be a lethal weapon. It seems eminently sensible to require that all license and certificate holders should pass both a written and an (inanimate target) firing test of competence before being licensed or certificated.

The tests could include the shooters ability to judge distance, to withhold fire when the target is either out of effective clean kill range or a non target species and would require a one hundred percent clean kill rate to achieve a pass. The reason for that being that if the shooting cannot be done humanely, unnecessary animal suffering is inevitable and the person concerned should not be allowed to use a gun on a live animal. 

There is something deeply worrying about children being taught to kill animals for sport. In my opinion children should not be allowed access to or ownership of guns of any sort, including airguns, below the age at which they could take a car driving test. In my view children should be taught to care and not to kill for sport.

The next question that needs to be addressed is the character and mental health of the licensed shooter. In much the same way as a driving licence can be withdrawn on doctors advice, it seems entirely reasonable to withdraw a shotgun license or firearms certificate on medical grounds. Such licenses and certificates should also be immediately and permanently withdrawn if the holder is convicted of a relevant criminal offence, such as one of violence.

To enable the authorities, both medical and legal to do their work with regard to withholding or withdrawing licenses, it should be a condition of the license being held or granted, that the GP is advised and that the GP informs the relevant authorities if the patients’ condition merits such action. Quite apart from the obvious cases of depression and dementia, action should also be taken in cases where the patient has a condition which would affect their ability to shoot such as cataracts, arthritis or Parkinsons disease, on the grounds that they could no longer reliably kill humanely. 

The short best short answer to the consultation is, that guns are lethal weapons and that anyone to be allowed one must pass the appropriate tests first and that they should have their licence withdrawn if they break the law or become medically unfit. If you want to respond to the Consultation, please visit the Committee’s website.

37 comments

Marissa
Great blog LACS!! Your so right. Adding I remember watching a taxidermy program on tv and these people need guns to kill animals to sadly stuff. What distressed me the most was African tours which promote you'll get to kill a huge amount of animals to say get one lion who's head gets mounted on a wall. I've often questioned the mental state of these people as their attitude was not sound state of mind. We have no gun policies here in Australia and i hope that spreads to the global community too. mgm.
Alexis Wolf
Good comment. I would like to add to this; I feel NO ONE should have any firearm in a home situation. The risk is to great. Farmers and gamekeepers should not have access either. If they can prove there is a problem with wildlife then official trained marksmen could be called on to eradicate any problem. After Cumbria the usual "don't act in haste" call is trotted out. I feel we SHOULD act immediatly. All firearms should be removed from the community. Why wait for another Cumbria for the sake of a few to have freedom to own a firearm? again, the risk is to great. Secure gun clubs are acceptable if they really are secure. No one needs to take a gun home.
Mr J. Arthur
I live in an urban district where there are a few fields with paths going through them and for the last few years shooting for fun has escalated under the guise of "vermin control". My neighbours and I have complained over and over again to the police and the council yet have got nowhere. The birds they claim to be vermin are mainly woodpigeons but they have to us decoys to attract them as there are no roosting places within the farmlands. Recently I discovered that according to the General Licence, shooting any native wild birds is against the law and the so called "pest species" such as crows and woodpigeons can only be killed as a last resort after non-lethal means to resolve the problem have proved to be "either ineffective or impractical", but there must be a problem in the first place. When this shooting takes place the paths through the fields are effectively a no-go area to the residents even though the law is clearly being broken and our houses and lanes get showered with poisonous lead pellets. If the police and councils were to enforce the law there would be no need for most of these gun licences to exist as it is not a sport and we in this district know there are no vermin to control.
Steve Edwards
Unfortunately guns cannot be uninvented so there is no final solution to the use and misuse of these implements of death. However we have only to look accross the Atlantic at the USA where 'hunting' is an obsession and coincidentally or rather consequently civilians kill more of their fellow citizens with guns (barring actual civil war) than almost any country on Earth. It follows therefore that any measures to restrict or ban the use of guns can only make our country a safer, better place for man or beast. The evidence from Huntingdon, Dunblane and most recently in Cumbria is unequivocal. These unhappy,demented individuals might have managed to kill a small number of victims with other weapons but it was only the availability of guns which enabled them to kill so many. Likewise the more guns are regulated and restricted the more users at the margins and then even towards the core will conclude that shooting animals for sport or convenience is just not worth the bother. I write as the grandson of a lifetime gamekeeper who was shown how to use a shotgun at a very early age.
Joe
As a shooter I feel that many of the statements here a ridiculous, in particular the part about having both written and practical test before being allowed to own a gun. My response to this is how will the police find the time and staff (Oh, and money) to pay for this? As I suppose you would also be complaining if your taxes were raised. I would also like to ask, if dereck bird had killed all those people with a knife from his kitchen would you be calling for a ban on kitchen knives? Shooting is a historic sport which has involved shooting both live game and targets for many many years, parts of our culture such as this cannot be stopped because a small few have keen harmed. Anyway statistics show that you are more likely to be killed by a car than a gun - even if there were the same amount of each - and of course you will not be giving up your auto mobiles will you? Or even campaigning to stop the use of them because some animal are harmed by careless drivers are you? No i thought not!
Paul
I am an animal lover and strict vegetarian. I strongly believe all life should be treated equally and would never kill an animal for any reason. However, I am also a Shotgun License holder. Once a week I take my shotgun to the local clay pidgeon shooting ground and enjoy a round of shooting with a friend. At every clay pigeon shooting ground I have been to there is a rule stating anyone shooting animals will be removed from the premises and instantly banned (i have never heard of anyone actually doing it). Please dont tar all shooters with the same brush. I am an animal lover but enjoy a round of sporting clays in the same way you might enjoy a round of golf. it's a harmless and fun sport. Why should my hobby be taken away from me?
Ian
I am a trained hunter whom owns deer legal calibers and so you might have guessed i shoot deer, and consider that i do a very good job at it. Here is a question, if no one shoots deer, then how do they get controlled, as they have no natural predators. What happens to deer when they are not managed?, their condition deteriorates through passing on ticks and lice to each other causing disease, also eating everything around them which then has an effect on their condition, causing malnutrition and also damaging plants and areas for other wildlife, maybe this is what the members of LACS and the people whom believe all they say want, If you think leaving them to their own devices is the right action, then i`m affraid you are entirely wrong, even LACS shoot deer on their ground, but not very well. As for the likes of grouse moors and gamekeepers controlling predators, if it wasn`t for these custodians of the countryside then you would never see grouse, or other birds on the moors, as has been proved. You people need to wake up, everything has to be controlled in moderation, noone, not even the most ardent shooter wants to shoot every fox, or deer, or rabbit, or grouse, you get the picture. Ian
Dave Bould
I'm sorry if this offends anyone, but the above comments are typical of the uninformed and uneducated. I moved from the UK to the US some 15 years ago, with a largely negative view of 'hunting obsessed americans'. In that time my views have changed to the point where I am now both a gun owner and hunter. Fact... the overwhelming majority of hunters are highly ethical, and will not shoot where they are unsure of a clean kill. Fact... animals harvested by hunting have lived natural lives and have no carbon footprint as opposed to the factory farmed animals butchered and served up in styrofoam trays by Tesco. They are not abused or crowded into unsanitary concrete sheds, or veal crates (which I oppose vehemently). Fact... Hunters are some of the most ardent conservationists I have met and act as the eyes and ears of the authorities against poaching and environmental crimes. Fact... Small game such as rabbit can decimate crops. Left uncontrolled they can inflict crop damage on a biblical scale. Would you prefer their numbers to be controlled by indiscriminate poisons? Fact... Everthing I shoot I eat, it is natual meat untainted by growth hormones or animal antibiotics. If there is more than I need, it is donated to a food bank. On gun ownership, why should you people be allowed to enforce your pejudices onto 4,000,000 law abiding citizens who pose no threat to anyone. Why should you decide that their chosen pastime, even if it is only target shooting, should be outlawed. Fact... in every state where gun laws have been relaxed and people allowed to carry, crime hase gone down. Fact... 'If you outlaw guns, only outlaws will have guns" I saw an interesting bumper sticker the other day, and it is a FACT.. "Ted Kennedy's car has killed more people than my guns"
mikey boy
i think the above comments about shooting are very much of college students who have nothing better to do with their time.... pest are called pests and vermin because this is what they are , without control rats would run amock the councils ,schoolbins ect would be over run with problems and they would dramitically increase... without pest control...one shot ,one kill the pest feels no pain whatsoever ,,the pest carries diseases [rabbit,,that does so much damage its unreal[ the rat ,,the pigeon ect all need control and councils have no poisons or traps to do this job effectively.... before putting up stupid posts have a look at what rat wee does.... or rabbits that run amock and are responsible for horses being put down left right and centre.....[that dig up every field going] all if left unattended the population of these pests would triple in weeks not years ....
Neil Price
I have never in my life read such an uninformed, biased load of total garbage. Get your facts right before you attempt to force your own agenda on the general public who are mostly as ill informed as you are about firearms .
Will
Firerms control is a very contentious issue. To sugest that a "trained Marksman" should be on call to deal with pest's around a farm is quite ridiculous. I do however agree that there are too many animals killed unnecessarily in the UK by the general public. I think the biggest problem by far is with car ownership. The majority of road users employa rather poor standard of driving and this in turn leads to many animal fatalities on the roads. Far more people and animals are killed in RTA's than any other type of incident and I think it's time it stopped. Cars are used by criminals to assist crimes and as weapons in their own right. Imagaine the carnage if Raol Moat had driven a Toyota Prius at high speed through a busy pedestrianised area! In todays society with our public transport network cars are a luxury for the majority of people. The energy debt they create is simply horrendous, quite simply they should be banned and only people who can justify a direct need for a car should be granted one and then have to undergo more rigorous driver training before being allowed on the roads. The percieved dangers of firearm misuse pale into insignificance when compared the the dangers of car ownership and the poor and reckless driving of a large number of the population. As a cyclist I'm noticing the roads becoming more and more dangerous as people seem to concentrate more on changing the radio, talk on the phone or turn round to talk to their kids in the back seat than they do on the road. It's got to STOP!
Jenny Thompson
People who have guns are unhinged if you ask me - every one of them should be made to undertake some sort of rehabilitation to try and bring them back into normal society. We live in an age where only the authorities should have guns and the idea that ordinary people should be trusted with these tools of death is simply crazy. People in the countryside often say they need them but I know lots of people who have moved to the countryside and haven't felt the need to rush out to buy a gun to start killing things....let's hope that pretty soon the old type of 'country folk' are a thing of the past, replaced by more balanced and compassionate newcomers.
Peter May
Lets start banning knives as they kill more people than guns do and are easy to purchase, also lets ban cars as they also kill people..... we can go on on on
Mark
Dear Jenny Thompson, I wonder how many of the people you trust around you are gun owners? Doctors, Nurses, Judges, Policemen and women, politicians. (Ok maybe politicians was a bad example). My point is that we are not crazed nutcases just because we own a gun or rifle. It could equally be argued that all women might be prostitutes simply because they happen to have certain equipment. We like you are part of what normal society, although I suspect we both would agree society could do with being a bit more tolerant of others with perhaps different ideals and goals. Sadly the compassionate people are already here, you just don't realise it. We are the trained and skilled hunters who maintain a healthy balance in nature. We don't hate animals, we simply strive to control numbers and keep them at an acceptable level. We simply don't have any large predators to do that job for us anymore. Take a look at the numbers of car accidents involving deer on our roads. This is fact, not some propaganda being dished up to upset people. There are simply too many deer and drivers being left injured. Thanks to LACS for giving me the chance to put my side across.
Ian
Folks, If for one minute I thought that taking away legally held fire-arms would prevent crime and suffering - I would be all for it. Fact - handguns removed from private ownership & now goverment statistics show an increase in usage of illegal weapons (hand guns). Legislation has been shown not to be the answer. Prey species like Deer / Rabbits etc are very fertile & without control of numbers disease becomes rife, condition deteriorates. At the same time, control by chemical methods has proved ineffective and the results are nothing short of obscene. Myxymatosis anyone? I fully agree that shooters should be competent before being permitted to shoot live quarry - indeed I make a living training such shooters and deer controllers to a high standard. However, removing the tool that allows humane control in the absence of natural predators would be a disaster. Jenny commented that balanced and compassionate newcomers are replacing the 'country folk'. Well Jenny, it is a strange fact that shortly after their gardens and crops are decimated, these 'newcomers' are the very ones asking for help in controlling the numbers of pests destroying their garden produce. Some folks can only learn by real life experience - others can look at the bigger picture & form their own judgements. As has been mentioned previously, LACS, RSPCA el al, all use firearms to humanely despatch deer and pests on ground they manage. There is a reason! Rgds Ian
Lee
@ Jenny Thompson You said:We live in an age where only the authorities should have guns and the idea that ordinary people should be trusted with these tools of death is simply crazy. What? Like Nazi Germany you mean? Or China under General Mao ? No thanks Jenny! I really do feel sorry for idiots like you. You genuinely have my pity and I pray for you Jenny like I do for the 6 million disarmed Jews the Nazis killed in the Sho'ah.
Peter
"People who have guns are unhinged if you ask me" Nobody in their right mind will be asking you!
Number3
Good grief! I find the comments of Jenny Thompson to be staggering and frankly quite offensive. What about our brave boys who are currently fighting abroad, are they unhinged? You will no doubt argue that they need guns as they are in the military but clearly they made the conscious decision to join the army so one action is a natural consequence of the other isn't it? "let's hope that pretty soon the old type of 'country folk' are a thing of the past, replaced by more balanced and compassionate newcomers" - I presumed this to be a joke when I first read it! What a ridiculous thing to say about millions of hard-working folk who provide the food that you so conveniently lift from the shelves of your supermarket. You're attitude is bourne of ignorance and really has no place in a balanced society.
Rob Smith
I have never read so much nonsense in all my life, I am tired of do gooders and city people making out country people are cruel animal haters. We are not. We enjoy the countryside and love to hunt and shoot, its that simple. If you dont like it, don't do it. stay away. Go down the local football stadium with the rest of the neandertal yobs, get drunk, abuse the referee with the other 60,000 in the stadium, go home, beat the wife and children and vomit your hard earned lager in some shop doorway calling it a great day out. I will continue to hunt thanks.
James
'in my opinion' as so rightly put. This is not fact, simply the opinion of another small minority, who agree with freedom of speech, as long as it only applies to themselves! I would request that, as someone who both owns and manages an air rifle, shooting pest species to manage the crops that everyone easts (unless you would wish us to become 100% reliant on foreign food imports? Having visited even the best abattoirs, the life of a farm animal is a primary concern. I wonder if the author purchases their food from a large chain supermarket, or if they ask their local butcher, as I do, on the source of their food? I visited the actual farm where my meat came from, and was satisfied that at all stages, it was acceptable, but this is rarely the case in all circumstances. An edible species which can be both LEGALLY and HUMANELY (note that the law does not allow inappropriate use of a tool to do a job, if the weapon is not appropriate for the subject, it is illegal anyway. ) can be taken with less awareness and certainly suffering than even the best treated farm animal, as they live completely wild until the point they are taken. On a different note, more claw hammers are used in violent offences, and are uncontrolled by ANY legislation, than 'weapon's of any sort. A rifle is another tool, nothing more, nothing less. If claw hammers were to be banned due to the public outcry of a few less informed but loud and opinionated individuals blaming them for the 1 or 2 in 60+ million people who shouldn't be allowed near a sharp object, then how long would it be before houses fell down? tools are exactly that, and the less informed reactionaries should consider the impacts of their statements prior to lambasting something they know only basic propaganda about until they have both a full understanding and are able to understand the rationale which goes into both sides of an argument. Now, the chances of this comment disagreeing are somewhat slim at best in making it through the filters, but I hope that they do, as I believe (again a personal belief, not a fact, please bear that in mind) that it reflects a more balanced view to counteract the overly reactionary and ill informed original authors 'facts'. Regards
Robert
Your right about not always guarenteed a kill when you shoot. i speak on behalf of all shooters when i say we always shoot for a clean kill. but the only thing that can ensure a 100 percent clean kill is dogs. you hunt with dogs the prey either runs away or it gets killed. yet when it came to baning hunting with hounds your gruop said shooting is the only humaine way? and if hunting with hounds and dogs is "crewl" and so is shooting. then what? and what about fishing? theres no end to how far we can go with this i personaly think. if a looney wants to go and kill people then he or her can get hold of a gun end of. look at how gangs in london ect ect do it. When i was a school we had a teacher called Mrs Jane Evans who i belive is alot to do with your group, how she is allowed to teach is miles beyond me, everyone is entitled to their own view wihich i appreciate and understand but this woman was so one sided with the children it was crazy, there wasnt one balanced argument from the teachers point of view which is just plain wrong just shows me how much you people try to brian wash people into how we are so called sick people. which plain isnt on. it's disgracfull.
John Rhodes
Owning a gun does not make you a murderer anymore than eating meat makes you a cannibal. Legislation is only obeyed by the law abiding. Murderous rampages and War are part of our lives which seem unavoidable. I doubt whether Mr. Vaz will find any answers by further controlling the sport and hobby of millions of people.
Kevin
Sigmund Freud: "A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity." ("General Introduction to Psychoanalysis," S. Freud) @Jenny Thompson - any thoughts on this quote from an (obviously unhinged) eminent doctor?
Andy
Blaming Guns for killing people is a bit like blaming pencils for spelling mistakes.Most people who dont shoot,dont realise that the UK has some of the toughest gun laws in the world. Doctors are already consulted before certificates are issued and if there is any reason either before/or during the life of the firearms certificate, which leads the authorities to think that you are no longer a suitable candidate to keep guns then the certificate is revoked and the guns and ammunition are taken away, similarly you lose your certificate for drink driving convictions,and after any period of police custody over 3 years. Getting on to the subject of shooting animals, due to massive overpopulation of the world by humans (still increasing every year) there sadly is the need to manage nearly all ecosystems in the world. Animals simply cant be allowed to breed unchecked, If that were the case, they would pretty soon expand to a point where they were too numerous for the land that they occupied. Nature of course would step in at this point and numbers would EVENTUALLY be reduced. Lack of food would lead to long lingering deaths from disease and starvation causing untold suffering.Surely a quick death from a bullet is infinitely better than 'Natures Way' which is harsh and uncaring in everyway possible. Roe deer have two youngsters a year, and if female, those youngsters com/e into breading condition in their second year. Then each of them can in turn have two youngsters, and so it goes on and on. If there was no deer control imaging the sheer numbers of deer there would be eating crops and decimating woodland. This would also have a massive impact on other animals and birds, whose essential habitat would be destroyed. Sadly deer/vermin control is essential, and if done in a responsible and correct manner benefits the wildlife in the long term.
Phil
Farmers and gamekeepers should not have access either. If they can prove there is a problem with wildlife then official trained marksmen could be called on to eradicate any problem.Alexis Wolf I live on farm and i keep ducks, chickens, and geese, a few weeks ago i had a fox jump over the fence and start attacking my chickens at about 4pm i heard the chickens going mad, i grabbed my rifle got a higher point in my house and then shot the fox, i only lost two chickens, a week next tuesday or in 20 minutes is too long to wait when my chickens are being killed
Gavin Haywood
What total cobblers. "Trained Marksmen" - I shoot every week, have done since I was about 12. I'm a hell of a lot better trained and a far more skilled shot than most "trained marksmen". I don't need some snivelling little twerp like Alexis telling me what should be banned or not. Cars kill thousands every year. You bleat on about civil liberties and yet are happy to have firearms banned when the vast majority are used by law-abiding members of the community. Cretin
Barry Woodward
Why should the legitmate ownership of guns be abolished merely because it upsets a bunch of bigots like the staff and members of the so-called League against Cruel sports. I'm pleased to hear LACs is on the verge of bankruptcy. I hope it comes soon. I've no time for Fascists and Nazis.
Guy
Thanks to an upstanding member of the community who knocked me off of my motorcycle with his car I am now largely disabled. I was once a very active ourdoorsman - climbing, camping, rambling etc. Shooting paper targets is now the only sport I can participate in on an equal footing. I'm a member of several clubs - which means I need to keep my rifles at home so that I can go to various venues to take part in competitions. Now I see the usual bigots (probably car drivers) want to take what little pleasure I can still enjoy. I'm sure it'd be a different story if their ability to enjoy their own property were being threatened.
Pete
Ironically, the same civil liberties that grant you the freedom of speach protect the rights of gun owners. I find it rather a pity that you choose to apply this libery constructing incoherent arguments based on heresay, recycled rhetoric and unsubstantiated statistics. But then again, you probably only think that freedom of speach is a good idea if someone is agreeing with you!
Some Bloke
To address the opening paragraph - Quote: “Take a step back and ask yourself these two questions: Why do we allow people to hold firearms at home and why do we allow them to use them to shoot and kill animals for sport? Unquote We could all single out many aspects of modern life so let’s try this one: Why do we allow mums to keep cars at home when the kids could walk to school, and why do we allow them to use a car for their shopping? The car is a common killer of people and property during what might be called - in sensationalist terms a violent incident that can be avoided by banning the car. We’ve all seen women doing their hair in the mirror – and how many people do we see holding a mobile phone while driving? So why not make them take a driving test before granting them a licence to kill and pollute? Ah but a test IS taken yet still the carnage goes on! My point is that while LACS has a hang up about shooting, others have a thing about women drivers for example. Rabbits for example were brought to these shores by the Romans to provide a rapid breeding meat source, hence the phrase “they breed like rabbits”. The climate way back then was colder so the rabbit population was fairly modest. Climate change has made our countryside a bountiful place for them to over breed and get out of control. This is at a time when men with guns are becoming less commonplace as the countryside is turned into towns and cities, and the general population sees less need for guns and sources it’s food at supermarkets rather than acquiring it the old way. How many people in your street have a vegetable patch? We rely more heavily on professional food producers than ever before and the producer has to protect his investment in every way possible. That includes pest or vermin control, and shooting is sure to target the correct species rather than other wildlife that causes no harm. Many farmers have large wooded areas that could be ripped down to provide more land for the plough but there is another use for some of it that will still turn a profit. A game shoot is one such activity that also gets people and their dogs out and about in the country. If the farmer cannot make a respectable profit from his land he’s going to possibly sell it for more housing but that’s something else for another action group to bitch about another day.
graham009
Here this is what will happen in the uk if we ban gun's! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HNdIBZWhzO8&feature=player_embedded
Gayle
We live in a cruel world. Yet we have the power to change things for the better. Unfortunatly it appears we choose not to.
Vivien Moorhouse
I just saw this discussion on firearms and felt so strongly that I felt I had to add to the letters. - Three weeks ago one of the evenings we had someone come around here with a gun and shot a neighbours beautiful pet tabby cat. - you can imagine their shock and distress to go outside to call him in - only to find him lying by their gate dead. - whoever that cruel person was doesn't know the heartache they caused the family ( and probably that type of low life that could do something like that to a harmless pet - wouldn't even care anyway ! ) - No I believe strongly that people should not be allowed to own guns of any type at home. - Why should they need them anyway - its usually to harm some poor unsuspecting animal anyway. - Bann all guns at home, - they usually end up in the wrong hands !!
Brian Mitchell
I live in the country and I have no need for a gun. When I feel the need to shoot wildlife I use a camera.
Adam
I am a former actavist with LACS, a vegetarian, a cat partner/ownee and owner of several guns for target shooting. I have great sympathy for gayle and the incident involving the poor cat but I feel the incident involved an air gun not a legally held firearm or shotgun as the urban use of such would of been very difficult and likely to be spotted by someone. The way to prevent issues like this is to have strict prison sentances for anyone misusing any gun in a frightful way as mentioned. Baning the home keeping of my Lee Enfield, Ruger or marlin rifles or my shotgun would not prevent incidents like you mention. More control over the sale and use of airguns is what is needed as this is where you'll find the idiots. A licenced firearm holder can only use his/her weapon at an approved range or shooting ground and the random discharge of this type of weapon in a garden environment would probably result in teh police Fire arms squad surrounding the house. Us gun owners probably have more information held on us by teh police than any otehr law abiding group of citizens. The casual use of a gun to shoot a cat in. A clear distinction must be made by LACS and LACS supporters regarding killing animals as an issue as opposed to gun control. If all home ownership of guns was banned only the rich who had their own land or who would pay to have them looked after on land woudl carry on shooting . The average working class person who belongs to a local clay shoot or target rifle club would be priced out of the sport. guess which one of the 2 groups is more likely to shoot animals? I rest my case.
Steven Ault
Shooting is not really a form of wildlife management. It's a cheap alternative to wildlife management. So long as guns exist, management alternatives will never be persued. Deer and 'game' birds are bred to be shot, sometimes for food, mostly for sport. The deer numbers in the UK are certainly not naturally occuring, despite what the Countryside Alliance may say. They are mostly bred to be culled! There's a lot of deception in the rural economy. It's not about pest control, it's about money. I find it astonishing that we can put a man on the moon but can't find ways of protecting chickens from foxes. I just think there are many trigger happy people who just love killing. Anyone who kills for sport has a problem and needs psychiatric help if you ask me. Any member of the public who wishes to own a gun is'nt really of sound mind. The LACS campaigns against killing for sport. I think some of you have taken things a little too far. Farmers may indeed need guns, but there are a lot of hunting, war, and gun obsessed people in society who are of concern.
Sebastian
Where I live asking soemone if they own a gun would get a "yes" about as often as asking them if they owned a car. The truth that when secnds count the police are ony minutes away is quite obviouis in rural America.I bought my first pistol a few weeks ago, primarily for home protection and to carry on walks and bicycle rides. You never know what kind of animals my pop out of the woods. Bears and mountain lions have been reported in my county. I've seen a bobcat on my back porch and in my front yard. Plus a wild dog or coyote is always a possibilty.As for doctors, my doctor made enough mistakes in my treatment for me to go elsewhere. Simple stuff like incorrectly running glucose test and such. We could save a lot of lives if doctors policed themselves better.I think I'll use Trey's response if asked. I keep my gun unloaded but the clip and gun within reach of each other.

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